Roscoe Brumback

Roscoe Brumback lives in Montrose, MI, and was raised in Kilmarnock, VA, a small town in eastern Virginia’s Northern Neck. He is married and a father to four adult sons and one adult daughter. He was interviewed because of his broad life experiences in Virginia, in the Navy, and in the automotive industry, which exposed him to people of all classes and races, and because of his distinctive honesty, good humor, and wit.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, basically I have a 30 year, 30 plus, year career in automotive manufacturing. Started off mostly in the quality side of things: statistical process control; working my way as a technician, sort of on-the-job type stuff; and then you know, working over the years and different

areas; had gone through quality to director status; worked in several companies and then moved into plant management; in the last, probably 19 years of my career, running manufacturing operations from 250 employees up to 540, you know, $300,000,000 operations.

And then pretty much have gone, you know, I’ve done my time in there I’m at the point just recently where I want to phase out of the manufacturing day-to-day manufacturing, and so I’ve just formed a little LLC and started consulting with automotive groups throughout the US.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, moved up to the to Michigan; love, love took me there and I married up there and pretty much if you’re up in Michigan and you’re staying in Michigan, you’re going into the automotive or some related field that’s involved in that. So, I originally went up there my first wife and married her, had two kids with her and basically started my career in the automotive business up there.

Where are you in life now?

Roscoe Brumback:

My family now is, I’m happily married to my wife, Margie, for 16 years now. We have five kids. We call it a blended family I guess you’d call it; I have three she has two boys ranging from 38 to 22 and we have just recently become empty nesters. So, you know now our life is changing a little bit; Margie is very involved and is a professional in the automotive world as an HR director for a large manufacturer, doing a lot of traveling, so we’re sort of in this interim period where, you know, we’re doing our thing.

We’re traveling a lot but starting to edge towards retirement starting to consider that really now. I don’t think I’ll ever fully retire, I’m not sure about Margie, but we’re looking forward to slowing down a little bit. Her parents have a centennial farm that we’re actually looking at purchasing and moving into the community that she grew up in. So, we’re starting to say Margie’s making some big moves up in business I’m making some moves out and phasing out a little bit from day-to-day, and you know, looking more for quality of life is what I’m really trying to focus on now. Family, kids, I just became a grandfather so, so you know that keeps you, that, you know, that it’s just a whole change going on. I’m in a real transitional period now, so my career is really over, and I’m really just sort of tracking towards what’s going to be good for the future.

Roscoe Brumback:

I think with people, I’ve just always been able to get along with all groups. I think that, you know, I got the vernacular of the street or something like that. I know a lot about that, I’ve worked at different levels, but overall, I think that I’m genuine with people. I’m a very honest person I would say. I’m probably a little blonde at times, but I’m a kind person and you know that’s, that’s probably, you know, one of my biggest, I think one of my biggest strengths.

And I think I can empathize with people, I have the ability to talk to people. I enjoy talking to different people; I don’t want to just be stuck with one group of, working, you know, with any one group of people or executive-types or anything like that. I enjoy the mix of people. I think it’s part of the richness of life. You learn things from them, you see people, you know, I’ve just, I don’t think, I think I can I have the ability to get along with people. I don’t put them on edge. I think I can just talk, you know, and I pick up situations I think and can deal with situations without embarrassing myself or somebody or hurting people’s feelings. I think I’m very conscious of people’s feelings and, you know, just over the long term I think that’s work for me, you know.

What about your love of music?

Roscoe Brumback:

Probably ever since I was young, I’ve played music, you know, in one form or another. Probably around the eight, I think, the eighth or ninth grade we actually started a band. I was a drummer. I still drum, I still play. That We started a band, we used to play at little grade school parties and things like that, and always enjoyed that. And just over the years, I’ve stayed around it and had equipment in my basement and played and things like that.

And probably about, probably 15 years ago now, maybe right around there, and we started, I started a fairly serious band and we picked up. I consider ourselves a good garage band with a great guitar player. We actually found a guitar player that worked as a supplier to our company and years ago it worked with Ted Nugent, so he sort of took us from my basement out and we started playing out. So, I’ve always been around it. We did that for about 5, 4 or 5 years. Played around the Detroit, Anne Arbor, Ypsilanti, Michigan area; never any further than that mostly as a gas and then I just enjoyed that. You know, it’s always, it was, I’ve always enjoyed playing music.

Now, I have my basement set up like a small studio, nothing fancy but I have some digital recording things so people get together now and we’ll, we’ll jam a little bit it. We’ll play, we’ll record some stuff. Sometimes we’re having parties in the neighborhood and it’s funny to bring people downstairs and put them on the microphone and let them hear how they sound coming through speakers and people singing.

So do a lot of that, but I’ve stayed, I’ve stayed with music, I’ll probably always do it, you know, coming up here pretty soon I’m going to a think up in Central Michigan University where there’s just a bunch of musicians and for three days just people just playing, different people playing together with different groups, so I’ll always stay around it. I don’t think I’ll ever have my own band again.

But I’ve always enjoyed jamming and I’ve all, I still enjoy playing. I go down there nights and just put the headphones on, and you know, just play the music and, you know, it’s just, it’s a good release for me.

Do ethics apply to business?

Roscoe Brumback:

I think they do. I think that they need to. I think they need to have more play in business than they do. I think, unfortunately, a lot of times dollars compromise ethics. And I don’t think that in business there’s ever a true standard ethic that’s applied. I think business is a whole series of situational ethics being applied at given a different situation. You apply a different ethic. I don’t think there’s a standard that goes across the board that holds business people up to such a high level. I think ethics start from the top and the companies represented by their senior management, and if that isn’t there at the top, it doesn’t exist below. But I think there’s a great need for it going forward.

I’m not a real political guy. I’m not a real world thought guy, but I think a lot of the things that we’ve done exploiting Third World have I think that there’s a lack of ethic in taking care of our own country and some of the things that we’ve done in smaller countries that I don’t think that we’ve just chased the dollar bill. So, I think the real true ethics and this is where I guess if I am going to speak to political and if I’m allowed to talk about a candidate that’s coming up now. Trump I look at him and I like the idea of bringing work back, if that’s really possible. And I’d like to keep the work here and keep our people working in the United States, you know, and we, I think it’s unethical what some companies are doing, doing manufacturing, another company being taxed in another area, not bringing revenues back to the US. I think those level of ethics, anytime big dollars and shareholder equity involved is, I don’t think there’s a standard high level of ethics being played. I think it’s all relative to what shareholder equity, equity dictates and therefore I think ethics are always situational.

What are your business ethics?

Roscoe Brumback:

I think that, you know, I think I’m a very ethical person and I will err on the side of that it wouldn’t necessarily work as well for me doing, taking a certain path. Not trying to be, you know, heroic or anything, but I think I’d take a higher road with most things. I see, I don’t ever want to hurt anybody, any one person. I would never do anything to do that. I don’t think that, I would really, don’t knowingly do unethical things. I’m irreverent, but I’m not unethical.

Where did your ethics come from?

Roscoe Brumback:

A lot of it was, just, it was a lot of it have to do with this area growing up in this area the way that, you know, our parents raised us. That there was a level, I mean, I was, you know, we had parents that took the time to talk about morality and certain things. I mean, in between getting in trouble and always pissing them off there was, we were raised around ethical people. At least, you know, most of the people that you and I know. I would have to say that the majority of those people led ethical lives; they had a strong moral fiber.

There was a strong religious group down here and I think a lot of that was just I, you know, I don’t know that, I don’t know that that’s an innate thing. I think that’s an acquired thing and I think that I developed all the start of it down in this area in the Northern Neck.

Roscoe Brumback:

Yeah, I mean I think I am more of a people person now than I’ve ever been. I think I’m a nicer person and I’ve ever been; if that’s an ethic I don’t know. If that’s the way, I just, I’m nicer when I deal with people. I have a nice ethic about me. I’m calmer than I’ve ever been for you several years now and I think that I’m just more mellow now. I don’t know if I can call that an ethics, just a lifestyle difference that affects my ethic.

Roscoe Brumback:

I don’t go to church. I haven’t, when I was a little kid about, I probably haven’t in 40 years, maybe 50 years, you know, go to different events things like that but I don’t, you know, I don’t have a specific, you know, religion. I know I’m a Christian; I pray a lot, I think, I talk, I believe in God, so I talk constantly to

God throughout different days, different things, different events. So, I’m a Christian person but I don’t, I get nothing from going to church. It doesn’t provide anything for me.

I don’t think it’s, you know, it’s no big deal that I’m not there for anybody else. I’ve allowed our kids to develop as they want to. A couple of them are practicing Catholics. The two of them, you know, one’s agnostic, you know, and so the others, you know, they go every now and then, you know, but it’s, I don’t put any pressure on them. And I’ve never felt pressure to go to church. The, my needs with God and Jesus and all like that are entirely separate of a church and more a day-in day-out type of deal for me.

Roscoe Brumback:

No, I’m not really hung up on that at all. I mean, you know the church itself, I mean, you know the Catholic priests are all having their issues right now but you

know that I consider, you know, you know I don’t blame the Catholic Church for that. I blame their lack of action on them but there’s nothing that really turns me on or off about any specific church as an institution. I was, I was Episcopalian and you know as a kid. And you know, so it mostly was just a hassle being forced to get up on Sunday morning, wear a coat and tie, which I hated doing, and go and sit in an uncomfortable pew.

Roscoe Brumback:

You know, I think my understanding of capitalism, you know, that I grew up with is, you know, it is it is money and profits and things, but you need… I’m a believer in my understanding of capitalism that companies develop jobs and you need large companies and, you know, you need, you know, people, you know, you need, you need to have a society that has, that develops and manufactures and does things. And I think that, you know, we’re getting away from that now as a country and, you know, becoming a burger flopping kind of nation and I just think that I think capitalism, free enterprise I think has to be out there.

I think large companies are good despite what everybody else says. They supply thousands and thousands of jobs out there. Do there need to be things changed about the way they deal? Yeah. Do we have to do, you know more, a little bit more focus on American manufacturing again? Yes, things like that are, but capitalism to me is purely money. I mean, it really boils down to me. But I don’t have any real philosophical answer for that, you know, to me it’s very, it’s real simple.

Roscoe Brumback:

I don’t, you know, I can tell you what, my interpretation would be of your question. I’m, is there, do I have a worldview that I’ve developed on my own right now? No, nothing specific. Am I, my worldview would probably be more eclectic having and especially having listened more or paying more attention to it. Part of this, I mean, understanding what’s going on with your, you know, this program that you’re doing, this project that you have going understanding it a little bit more would give me a better, you know some inroads into really answering the questions semi-intelligently.

Right now, I can’t really, my worldview is “don’t piss anybody off.” I think we need to protect ourselves. I think a lot of people don’t like the US. I think it’s the greatest place in the world. I think we’re the most benevolent group in society in the world no matter how bad we are in a lot of ways. But my worldview is that we need to sort of tighten up our gates a little bit here and start taking care of our own country a little bit more.

I know that’s a very dangerous area…

Doug Monroe:

No, no, no, no, no, that’s good. That’s all great. See, there is no wrong answer. This is an editorial statement again, but I wouldn’t have known what to say about worldview three or four years ago. Even though, even though I know you know a lot about worldview but you’re not in touch with…

Roscoe Brumback:

But I don’t know if I take any of that and really put it all into one ball and come up with a summary of that. I’ve just, it’s just a bunch of little shots.

Doug Monroe:

Yeah, right, exactly.

Roscoe Brumback:

Other than just expanding my view, seeing more people I’ve dealt with, a lot of different people in a lot of different areas. So, I just think the scope, I have a larger scope to deal with, you know, and that probably, you know, what would help me in the fact that I’ve got a pretty broad, you know, mix of different cultures. I’ve been around a lot of different cultures specifically through the Navy and mostly through playing rugby and playing the different teams that would come in on the Atlantic Fleet weapons training facility. So, we were meeting Germans and playing with, you know, rugby with them, partying with them.

Getting to know them, talking with them, English, Spanish, so and then I’ve been overseas, done a lot of work with the Japanese, you know, with automotive. So, I mean, my scope, the Northern Neck was very limited and what I knew about the world but it was a, it was a simplicity of the Northern Neck and a, just a nice, it’s just a calm, nice place. And a lot of the people, there’s a lot of people, least when I grew up in the Northern Neck. They seemed to be more of the same mind, now not being here in quite a while and being around the northern that can see now is developed, to me, it’s a lot of people that have moved in and changed it dramatically. There’s no, there is, there’s a core of some people that I see that I read on Facebook that they call it “you don’t know the river” and that are around that that really, you know, they still aspire to the Northern Neck.

The things that happen here and stuff like that. I don’t know, that, you know, I would say to tell you that there used to be more a one pulse, one heart amongst people. Maybe a little bit of separation between black and white, but at times it was pretty, everybody just seemed to sort of coexist together and there weren’t a lot of people from other areas, other states, other large cities that have come in to influence this place. The Northern Neck is sort of a melting pot now.

Roscoe Brumback:

More people got a handout. More people want something for nothing. I truly believe that I think the work ethic of a lot of our youth is eroding and I think that there’s a, I’m concerned with the fact that people are always, that a lot of people now just want to see how much they can get for doing nothing. And I think that’s been, I think that’s been involved that’s, you know, been on the forefront with the last elections.

This one coming up, you know, people are, people want to see, you have people at McDonald’s that want, you know, fifteen dollars an hour to do burgers and things like that. I mean, it’s getting a little, getting a little out there.

Roscoe Brumback:

I mean, the number one thing that’s ever happened in my life was marrying Margie. That transcends, you know, everything, that’s the number one. My kids, you know, having them and, you know, they’re all grown up now and, you know, so I mean some, probably those, you know, those are the two biggest. I mean, that’s what drives most people’s lives. Their wife and children and, I mean, that that’s what’s always driven me.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, in regard to marriage, I’ve tried it a few times I think it is a needed institution and I think it’s a good thing. I think you need to be with the right person. I think you should enter into it and not so young. I think entering in my case, getting married too young, I was too immature, I was not ready to be married and I was changing all the time. And I think, I think you’re always changing through life, but I think up until a certain point people don’t change together, they change separately and younger as they grow. As you get older and develop a longer-term marriage, I’m not saying that you’d necessarily change together, but you do more together than apart and a lot of things, you’re more, and I think, as a marriage matures which mine is just starting to, you know, only being 16 years I’m starting to find, you know, the really, the really good parts of the quote “institution.”

I just got married too young, was too immature, too irresponsible, and had too much left to do. And along the way hurt some people. So, and then spent a lot of time the latter years making amends for that for the most part as much as you can. Nut now, I mean, I am very happily married. Not that there aren’t issues with it. That I’m looking forward to really understanding the marriage better as I go forward.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, how would you name one group, person, entity, corporation for it? I mean, isn’t everybody responsible for it? In my mind that, you know, debt. I don’t know, some of it is recognizing all of it; do we really have this kind of debt, does it really exist, you know? I don’t know, to me, it’s sort of an enigma. I don’t really, yeah we got trillions of dollars in debt, what does that mean? How does it affect anything?

Suppose we just said, “No we don’t.” What changes? Nothing changes. So, I’m sort of, I don’t know that anybody’s to blame for it. You can say a lot of large companies have moved in and out, you say the government has not been fiscally responsible and a lot of their, you know, the transfer-type payments, the social programs that are out there mismanaged, I think, to a certain extent. If you were to take it from pure large dollars, I think our government is so big that probably the largest part of it comes out of there just from mismanagement. And, but I can’t be specific about it; this is just some sort of just winging it out there.

I don’t know how you could say that anybody would be lesser or more or less responsible than our government. So, the Fed that comes in and then the deal with the Fed not really being a part of the government but a private, they’re in the mix too, banking is in the mix, everybody’s in the mix, but I don’t think you can go after any one group of people. But overall, I think, I think poor management of the cut. The country’s not run like a good, efficient company. It’s too big, it’s unwieldy and as a result, there’s a lot of loss.

Roscoe Brumback:

I mean, that’s a hell of a question. I mean, to try to capture that, I mean, my solution I should jump back to what Ross Perot said and say, “Yeah, there’s a lot of good plans up there I’ll just go grab one and run with it.”

I mean, I don’t know. Get with the right people, develop a plan. A plan that’s out there. Get people to agree with it and then stay with it. You know, put it into place. I think that we have to take care of people; the elderly, the homeless. I’m not saying I want to get rid of welfare or social security or any of that like that, I just want it to be managed properly and that’s sort of, that’s, we need these social programs I, but, they can’t just perpetuate themselves and we can’t just have it go on into eternity.

We have to have the ability to get people in and out of these programs. So if I was to look for a cure and I was to go and say that it’s a lot of the social programs that are spending them out of control and it seemed that they will go into perpetuity like that, I think there should be an effort to focus on a plan to get people back into the workforce more so than just figure out how we can get them more money.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well I mean, you know, there’s extremes. I wouldn’t go to like the Chinese, one child type thing, you know, but there has to be controls. I mean, you know, and in these, in these programs, you can’t just have it so that somebody can go out and have seven or eight children. I mean, I don’t know exactly how that’s done. Do we need to beef up, are these groups that monitor, you know, the welfare system, these social workers, are there enough social workers monitoring people? Do we really know what people, how long that people go on it? How long we, you know, what’s the requirements?

Roscoe Brumback:

It’s, you know, let’s develop some finite requirements here. If a person’s healthy enough to go on, are they mentally healthy enough to go on? Some evaluation there and then the set up temporary programs but not a program that perpetuates itself every year. So, I don’t know, I guess there would be more checks and balances to the system and more oversight with the people that are on the dole. And that’s probably, you know, that’s not an answer but I just think if you would take a look right now, if you talk about social workers.

In a case in point right now, trying to deal with my mother getting there transitioned into Medicaid. It’s the biggest bureaucratic nightmare I’ve ever seen with virtually every case worker, at least where I am in the Detroit area, completely inundated and will flat out tell you they have no abilities to complete their daily tasks. They do what they do. You are in line and that’s the way it works. That in other cases, I mean, it’s a, you know, so they get to people. There’s too many people on it to control it. So, I think guidelines, more stricter, stricter guidelines. And not strict and that it restricts, you know, their benefits, in that they’re in control and that the intent is to get them back into society and functioning as a normal worker.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, so, if you were to take it from white collar type to blue collar who I work with a lot, both types I would see, that you would see that the white collar people for the most part, now the quote “white collar” on them for lack of a better term, they’re looking for, you know, more like a Republican-kind of candidate. They want change. And I think what a lot of people, one of my theories is I think Obama got elected because a lot of people were looking for change and so it was strictly, he got elected because he had promised a different kind of change.

Now, you’ve got Trump coming in and he’s promising something different for the middle and upper-middle class that they’re frustrated with. So maybe he’s not the best candidate in the world and, you know, obviously, you know, there’s a lot of issues about him, but he represents change and people are willing… so, I would say that near more white collar type worker is saying, “Let’s just bring about change and see if it benefits us at all. We feel like we’re carrying the brunt of a tax base” and things like that and feel like that, you know, we’re really, you know, supporting America.

The blue collar, more blue collar would be at least in the Detroit area, especially in all the Midwest for the most part, you know, all the automotive producing areas, they’re very much democratic-leaning and looking for more, you know, from the government to supply more to them, you know, in the unions. And the unions have lost some power and they’re trying to make a play back and come back strong again, that if you do, if you have a Republican group which is weird this time because Trump has sort of appealed to the unions in bringing work back, so he’s done a pretty good job there in appealing to a group of people that would have never listened to him before, but not doing it with more wages but doing it from the line of let’s keep America’s jobs here. So, he’s having an effect there that’s never been a factor before.

Roscoe Brumback:

The potential to get more. Not the management as much. Well, I would say, yeah, I would say that too but from both sides more of what they consider they need. You know, the management teams want to keep work here more so, you know, and more concerned with that and concerned with launching new jobs vs an hourly person who does, they don’t worry about it as much as that because they do the same type of work just with a different program for, say, an automotive. So, but, I just, I think both sides people are looking for a change. I would, I think, that’s it we’re, I think, from a management team we think that you know, we suffer the brunt of the tax base.

Roscoe Brumback:

Not, I don’t think, as a, this is just my opinion and not bound with any facts per say that I can quote, but I think that our foreign policy is non-existent. I don’t think that there’s any respect given to the US right now. I’m extremely concerned with the Middle East and some of the, you know, then, and Somalia and those areas. I think there’s a lot of people that would like to blow us up.

I think it’s a time for us to tighten our borders up. I know this flies in the face of a lot of people; that America was, you know, brought up on Ellis Island and that’s what we are, a nation of immigrants. That at a certain point, you have to, you have to take a look at the greatest good for the greatest number. It’s like triage.

By the greatest good for the greatest number right now, in my opinion, is to limit immigration. Let’s establish how we are going to work with it in the future. I’m not saying build a fence or anything like that or a wall; that won’t do anything. But let’s take a look at the, let’s just to control what we have now. Let’s take, let’s stop opening the gates and especially why we’re in situations where we cannot protect ourselves internally. So, I think it’s less a moral issue than it is a safety issue right now. So, I override the immorality that people see in it by stating that I think we need to take a harder look at immigration, control our borders under the gu… under the name of safety to protect ourselves as a nation.

Roscoe Brumback:

I don’t know what it is. I don’t really, I could guess at what I think social justice is. But I don’t fully, it’s not something I even think about. But if I take a look at social justice and I were to try to define it, I would think that, you know, social justice has to do with, you know, I mean, we’ve been stuck on this ethical approach to life and morality and things like that, so I think social justice is a matter of that, that, you know, society dictates certain actions of thinking people. And we can’t go into anarchy and just, you know, you have to have sanctions to maintain some sort of social justice. So, my ideal is social justice is just, it’s just how we do the right things in the world to keep the world running and don’t let it just run amok. but I have no, I haven’t given, to give you a definition of that that would mean anything to anybody, I don’t really know.

Roscoe Brumback:

An easy answer about where the US is going is: boy, I’m not sure. But I’m hopeful that we are going to try, you know, to protect ourselves, to get our country back together so that maybe long-term we could be more of a, I think, I think all of a sudden, you know, the internet and everything, and we are such a global society now, and everything. I don’t think that systems and procedures and everything is ready to handle the world as it is. It’s evolved too much and we’re going along and it seems like we’re putting Band-Aids on things that don’t work anymore or trying to revamp something or re-engineer something versus rethink a new way to work in the world, to be around the world. Because physically, things have changed. Just, just I mean, the speed of sound is nothing now, you know? I mean, so it’s like you can you can communicate with anybody any time. People are much have much more accessibility to information. Third World nations can even be called Third World nations anymore. Truthfully, I mean, they’re almost at a par because of the internet with a lot of things they can do and how we deal with people. The potential for war right now, to me, I’m really worried about, especially if the Republican Party gets in and it’s as hard line as being professed right now, if we’re not going to get into a situation where somebody will flip the switch, I’m very concerned. You know, with, you know, ISIS, these groups like that. And I think you take a look, the Russians just got beat to death in Afghanistan.

We’re doing the same thing. It seems like we just keep putting ourselves into these situations. I think we’ve got to get out, phase out, get our shit together domestically and then start talking about how we deal with the rest of the world. You still have to, I’m not saying close us off and just close the rest of the world out, but slow it down a little bit. Let’s take a look at how we’re running things. Let’s not try to put Band-Aids on a system that’s broken. Let’s take a look at reorganizing, getting a system if there is any possible way. I don’t, I think we’re going to have more gridlock no matter who gets elected this time. And that’s the thing that bothers me the most. The reason I’m concerned about the government, I have no faith in their ability to to really represent us anymore. And I think that they’re entity unto themselves and they spend their whole time campaigning to be where they are and then nothing ever gets done. And I think the cycle in here is just too narrow. They spend two years, you know, they come in, they clean up the last regimes, what they’re doing, implement their start to implement their regime. Then they spend the next half of it campaigning. So, it’s just constant change. And, you know, there’s gridlock. It’s this non-stop gridlock. Nothing is getting done. I’m concerned that nothing’s going to get done going forward here for the next election, no matter who gets elected. Whether the person I want does or doesn’t, I don’t think anything’s going to change. I think we’re going to be in gridlock.

And the only thing that I’m really concerned about is if somebody pulls a switch and somebody blows up, you know, some country. I think that that’s really, I started, I forgot about that from like the 60s. I used to be afraid as a little kid because of the Russians. And I used to you know, I was, I would think about it at night and it bothered me. All of a sudden, everything went away and I never thought about that anymore. For the first time in my life in the last two years, maybe I’m starting to think about the fact that there, that somebody could pull the bomb again. There’s enough radical groups out there. There’s enough fissionable material out there that people get it. And money can get anything. You could be Satan and still get, if you had the money to pay somebody on the earth, they would take it and blow somebody without any compunction about blowing up another country because they got the money. I’m concerned that there’s a long road for America to go and long road for the world to go. And especially if America is having, America is having problems, because I do believe we are the most benevolent nation and the biggest giver and a good guide overall for the rest of the world to follow a system that seems to work. And when it was working right before we tried to become everybody’s everything and politically correct to the point that it’s insane, that nothing gets done. So, I’m not, I’m not optimistic about what’s going on in the next 5 to 10 years.

Roscoe Brumback:

Pessimistic. I am not, I don’t, I think there’s so many bright people in the world and I just don’t think that they’re stepping up and coming into the positions where we need them. I got, I think there’s people out there that are great salesman that are making pitches to people that really think they want to buy this new car, that this new regime or something like that, but I don’t think we have any, I don’t think we have strong leadership. And I don’t see anybody coming up through the system even that even wants the job. You know, a lot of people are good and don’t even want the job.

Roscoe Brumback:

Skilled people. That’s all I want. I could be, I could be without any party affiliation if good, intelligent, thinking people were in that position, I could vote any party. I’m not voting the party, I’m voting the person. In the past, I think I’ve been more blindly party just because my father, but over the last years, I mean, I’ve voted more what I thought the people. But it’s been getting worse and worse over the last two elections for sure. It’s a, I’m voting for the lesser of evils rather than a viable candidate.

Doug Monroe:

Exactly, right. Alright, last question. It’s part your chance fora parting shot s, o my statement is, “So the boss becomes a farmer and rides into the sunset. Sounds like Shane to me.”

Roscoe Brumback:

I am, I am going to retire in the next—not fully retire, in the next five to six years. I’m really considering buying my wife’s family’s farm. And God knows what I’m going to do when I get out there in the wide-open country. What I will grow, if you catch my drift. but I am going to start settling down and I’m going to consult for a while, probably do that on and off, but I’m slowing my pace down now. I’m done with my career. My real career. Now I’m just paying bills and trying to get a little bit of cash to you know, have a little bit of fun before I croak.

Doug Monroe:

Thank you, my friend. Unless you have anything else to say, I think I’ve hit the mother lode.

Roscoe Brumback:

Cool, it was fun.

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Overview

Roscoe Brumback

Roscoe Brumback lives in Montrose, MI, and was raised in Kilmarnock, VA, a small town in eastern Virginia’s Northern Neck. He is married and a father to four adult sons and one adult daughter. He was interviewed because of his broad life experiences in Virginia, in the Navy, and in the automotive industry, which exposed him to people of all classes and races, and because of his distinctive honesty, good humor, and wit.
Transcript

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, basically I have a 30 year, 30 plus, year career in automotive manufacturing. Started off mostly in the quality side of things: statistical process control; working my way as a technician, sort of on-the-job type stuff; and then you know, working over the years and different

areas; had gone through quality to director status; worked in several companies and then moved into plant management; in the last, probably 19 years of my career, running manufacturing operations from 250 employees up to 540, you know, $300,000,000 operations.

And then pretty much have gone, you know, I’ve done my time in there I’m at the point just recently where I want to phase out of the manufacturing day-to-day manufacturing, and so I’ve just formed a little LLC and started consulting with automotive groups throughout the US.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, moved up to the to Michigan; love, love took me there and I married up there and pretty much if you’re up in Michigan and you’re staying in Michigan, you’re going into the automotive or some related field that’s involved in that. So, I originally went up there my first wife and married her, had two kids with her and basically started my career in the automotive business up there.

Where are you in life now?

Roscoe Brumback:

My family now is, I’m happily married to my wife, Margie, for 16 years now. We have five kids. We call it a blended family I guess you’d call it; I have three she has two boys ranging from 38 to 22 and we have just recently become empty nesters. So, you know now our life is changing a little bit; Margie is very involved and is a professional in the automotive world as an HR director for a large manufacturer, doing a lot of traveling, so we’re sort of in this interim period where, you know, we’re doing our thing.

We’re traveling a lot but starting to edge towards retirement starting to consider that really now. I don’t think I’ll ever fully retire, I’m not sure about Margie, but we’re looking forward to slowing down a little bit. Her parents have a centennial farm that we’re actually looking at purchasing and moving into the community that she grew up in. So, we’re starting to say Margie’s making some big moves up in business I’m making some moves out and phasing out a little bit from day-to-day, and you know, looking more for quality of life is what I’m really trying to focus on now. Family, kids, I just became a grandfather so, so you know that keeps you, that, you know, that it’s just a whole change going on. I’m in a real transitional period now, so my career is really over, and I’m really just sort of tracking towards what’s going to be good for the future.

Roscoe Brumback:

I think with people, I’ve just always been able to get along with all groups. I think that, you know, I got the vernacular of the street or something like that. I know a lot about that, I’ve worked at different levels, but overall, I think that I’m genuine with people. I’m a very honest person I would say. I’m probably a little blonde at times, but I’m a kind person and you know that’s, that’s probably, you know, one of my biggest, I think one of my biggest strengths.

And I think I can empathize with people, I have the ability to talk to people. I enjoy talking to different people; I don’t want to just be stuck with one group of, working, you know, with any one group of people or executive-types or anything like that. I enjoy the mix of people. I think it’s part of the richness of life. You learn things from them, you see people, you know, I’ve just, I don’t think, I think I can I have the ability to get along with people. I don’t put them on edge. I think I can just talk, you know, and I pick up situations I think and can deal with situations without embarrassing myself or somebody or hurting people’s feelings. I think I’m very conscious of people’s feelings and, you know, just over the long term I think that’s work for me, you know.

What about your love of music?

Roscoe Brumback:

Probably ever since I was young, I’ve played music, you know, in one form or another. Probably around the eight, I think, the eighth or ninth grade we actually started a band. I was a drummer. I still drum, I still play. That We started a band, we used to play at little grade school parties and things like that, and always enjoyed that. And just over the years, I’ve stayed around it and had equipment in my basement and played and things like that.

And probably about, probably 15 years ago now, maybe right around there, and we started, I started a fairly serious band and we picked up. I consider ourselves a good garage band with a great guitar player. We actually found a guitar player that worked as a supplier to our company and years ago it worked with Ted Nugent, so he sort of took us from my basement out and we started playing out. So, I’ve always been around it. We did that for about 5, 4 or 5 years. Played around the Detroit, Anne Arbor, Ypsilanti, Michigan area; never any further than that mostly as a gas and then I just enjoyed that. You know, it’s always, it was, I’ve always enjoyed playing music.

Now, I have my basement set up like a small studio, nothing fancy but I have some digital recording things so people get together now and we’ll, we’ll jam a little bit it. We’ll play, we’ll record some stuff. Sometimes we’re having parties in the neighborhood and it’s funny to bring people downstairs and put them on the microphone and let them hear how they sound coming through speakers and people singing.

So do a lot of that, but I’ve stayed, I’ve stayed with music, I’ll probably always do it, you know, coming up here pretty soon I’m going to a think up in Central Michigan University where there’s just a bunch of musicians and for three days just people just playing, different people playing together with different groups, so I’ll always stay around it. I don’t think I’ll ever have my own band again.

But I’ve always enjoyed jamming and I’ve all, I still enjoy playing. I go down there nights and just put the headphones on, and you know, just play the music and, you know, it’s just, it’s a good release for me.

Do ethics apply to business?

Roscoe Brumback:

I think they do. I think that they need to. I think they need to have more play in business than they do. I think, unfortunately, a lot of times dollars compromise ethics. And I don’t think that in business there’s ever a true standard ethic that’s applied. I think business is a whole series of situational ethics being applied at given a different situation. You apply a different ethic. I don’t think there’s a standard that goes across the board that holds business people up to such a high level. I think ethics start from the top and the companies represented by their senior management, and if that isn’t there at the top, it doesn’t exist below. But I think there’s a great need for it going forward.

I’m not a real political guy. I’m not a real world thought guy, but I think a lot of the things that we’ve done exploiting Third World have I think that there’s a lack of ethic in taking care of our own country and some of the things that we’ve done in smaller countries that I don’t think that we’ve just chased the dollar bill. So, I think the real true ethics and this is where I guess if I am going to speak to political and if I’m allowed to talk about a candidate that’s coming up now. Trump I look at him and I like the idea of bringing work back, if that’s really possible. And I’d like to keep the work here and keep our people working in the United States, you know, and we, I think it’s unethical what some companies are doing, doing manufacturing, another company being taxed in another area, not bringing revenues back to the US. I think those level of ethics, anytime big dollars and shareholder equity involved is, I don’t think there’s a standard high level of ethics being played. I think it’s all relative to what shareholder equity, equity dictates and therefore I think ethics are always situational.

What are your business ethics?

Roscoe Brumback:

I think that, you know, I think I’m a very ethical person and I will err on the side of that it wouldn’t necessarily work as well for me doing, taking a certain path. Not trying to be, you know, heroic or anything, but I think I’d take a higher road with most things. I see, I don’t ever want to hurt anybody, any one person. I would never do anything to do that. I don’t think that, I would really, don’t knowingly do unethical things. I’m irreverent, but I’m not unethical.

Where did your ethics come from?

Roscoe Brumback:

A lot of it was, just, it was a lot of it have to do with this area growing up in this area the way that, you know, our parents raised us. That there was a level, I mean, I was, you know, we had parents that took the time to talk about morality and certain things. I mean, in between getting in trouble and always pissing them off there was, we were raised around ethical people. At least, you know, most of the people that you and I know. I would have to say that the majority of those people led ethical lives; they had a strong moral fiber.

There was a strong religious group down here and I think a lot of that was just I, you know, I don’t know that, I don’t know that that’s an innate thing. I think that’s an acquired thing and I think that I developed all the start of it down in this area in the Northern Neck.

Roscoe Brumback:

Yeah, I mean I think I am more of a people person now than I’ve ever been. I think I’m a nicer person and I’ve ever been; if that’s an ethic I don’t know. If that’s the way, I just, I’m nicer when I deal with people. I have a nice ethic about me. I’m calmer than I’ve ever been for you several years now and I think that I’m just more mellow now. I don’t know if I can call that an ethics, just a lifestyle difference that affects my ethic.

Roscoe Brumback:

I don’t go to church. I haven’t, when I was a little kid about, I probably haven’t in 40 years, maybe 50 years, you know, go to different events things like that but I don’t, you know, I don’t have a specific, you know, religion. I know I’m a Christian; I pray a lot, I think, I talk, I believe in God, so I talk constantly to

God throughout different days, different things, different events. So, I’m a Christian person but I don’t, I get nothing from going to church. It doesn’t provide anything for me.

I don’t think it’s, you know, it’s no big deal that I’m not there for anybody else. I’ve allowed our kids to develop as they want to. A couple of them are practicing Catholics. The two of them, you know, one’s agnostic, you know, and so the others, you know, they go every now and then, you know, but it’s, I don’t put any pressure on them. And I’ve never felt pressure to go to church. The, my needs with God and Jesus and all like that are entirely separate of a church and more a day-in day-out type of deal for me.

Roscoe Brumback:

No, I’m not really hung up on that at all. I mean, you know the church itself, I mean, you know the Catholic priests are all having their issues right now but you

know that I consider, you know, you know I don’t blame the Catholic Church for that. I blame their lack of action on them but there’s nothing that really turns me on or off about any specific church as an institution. I was, I was Episcopalian and you know as a kid. And you know, so it mostly was just a hassle being forced to get up on Sunday morning, wear a coat and tie, which I hated doing, and go and sit in an uncomfortable pew.

Roscoe Brumback:

You know, I think my understanding of capitalism, you know, that I grew up with is, you know, it is it is money and profits and things, but you need… I’m a believer in my understanding of capitalism that companies develop jobs and you need large companies and, you know, you need, you know, people, you know, you need, you need to have a society that has, that develops and manufactures and does things. And I think that, you know, we’re getting away from that now as a country and, you know, becoming a burger flopping kind of nation and I just think that I think capitalism, free enterprise I think has to be out there.

I think large companies are good despite what everybody else says. They supply thousands and thousands of jobs out there. Do there need to be things changed about the way they deal? Yeah. Do we have to do, you know more, a little bit more focus on American manufacturing again? Yes, things like that are, but capitalism to me is purely money. I mean, it really boils down to me. But I don’t have any real philosophical answer for that, you know, to me it’s very, it’s real simple.

Roscoe Brumback:

I don’t, you know, I can tell you what, my interpretation would be of your question. I’m, is there, do I have a worldview that I’ve developed on my own right now? No, nothing specific. Am I, my worldview would probably be more eclectic having and especially having listened more or paying more attention to it. Part of this, I mean, understanding what’s going on with your, you know, this program that you’re doing, this project that you have going understanding it a little bit more would give me a better, you know some inroads into really answering the questions semi-intelligently.

Right now, I can’t really, my worldview is “don’t piss anybody off.” I think we need to protect ourselves. I think a lot of people don’t like the US. I think it’s the greatest place in the world. I think we’re the most benevolent group in society in the world no matter how bad we are in a lot of ways. But my worldview is that we need to sort of tighten up our gates a little bit here and start taking care of our own country a little bit more.

I know that’s a very dangerous area…

Doug Monroe:

No, no, no, no, no, that’s good. That’s all great. See, there is no wrong answer. This is an editorial statement again, but I wouldn’t have known what to say about worldview three or four years ago. Even though, even though I know you know a lot about worldview but you’re not in touch with…

Roscoe Brumback:

But I don’t know if I take any of that and really put it all into one ball and come up with a summary of that. I’ve just, it’s just a bunch of little shots.

Doug Monroe:

Yeah, right, exactly.

Roscoe Brumback:

Other than just expanding my view, seeing more people I’ve dealt with, a lot of different people in a lot of different areas. So, I just think the scope, I have a larger scope to deal with, you know, and that probably, you know, what would help me in the fact that I’ve got a pretty broad, you know, mix of different cultures. I’ve been around a lot of different cultures specifically through the Navy and mostly through playing rugby and playing the different teams that would come in on the Atlantic Fleet weapons training facility. So, we were meeting Germans and playing with, you know, rugby with them, partying with them.

Getting to know them, talking with them, English, Spanish, so and then I’ve been overseas, done a lot of work with the Japanese, you know, with automotive. So, I mean, my scope, the Northern Neck was very limited and what I knew about the world but it was a, it was a simplicity of the Northern Neck and a, just a nice, it’s just a calm, nice place. And a lot of the people, there’s a lot of people, least when I grew up in the Northern Neck. They seemed to be more of the same mind, now not being here in quite a while and being around the northern that can see now is developed, to me, it’s a lot of people that have moved in and changed it dramatically. There’s no, there is, there’s a core of some people that I see that I read on Facebook that they call it “you don’t know the river” and that are around that that really, you know, they still aspire to the Northern Neck.

The things that happen here and stuff like that. I don’t know, that, you know, I would say to tell you that there used to be more a one pulse, one heart amongst people. Maybe a little bit of separation between black and white, but at times it was pretty, everybody just seemed to sort of coexist together and there weren’t a lot of people from other areas, other states, other large cities that have come in to influence this place. The Northern Neck is sort of a melting pot now.

Roscoe Brumback:

More people got a handout. More people want something for nothing. I truly believe that I think the work ethic of a lot of our youth is eroding and I think that there’s a, I’m concerned with the fact that people are always, that a lot of people now just want to see how much they can get for doing nothing. And I think that’s been, I think that’s been involved that’s, you know, been on the forefront with the last elections.

This one coming up, you know, people are, people want to see, you have people at McDonald’s that want, you know, fifteen dollars an hour to do burgers and things like that. I mean, it’s getting a little, getting a little out there.

Roscoe Brumback:

I mean, the number one thing that’s ever happened in my life was marrying Margie. That transcends, you know, everything, that’s the number one. My kids, you know, having them and, you know, they’re all grown up now and, you know, so I mean some, probably those, you know, those are the two biggest. I mean, that’s what drives most people’s lives. Their wife and children and, I mean, that that’s what’s always driven me.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, in regard to marriage, I’ve tried it a few times I think it is a needed institution and I think it’s a good thing. I think you need to be with the right person. I think you should enter into it and not so young. I think entering in my case, getting married too young, I was too immature, I was not ready to be married and I was changing all the time. And I think, I think you’re always changing through life, but I think up until a certain point people don’t change together, they change separately and younger as they grow. As you get older and develop a longer-term marriage, I’m not saying that you’d necessarily change together, but you do more together than apart and a lot of things, you’re more, and I think, as a marriage matures which mine is just starting to, you know, only being 16 years I’m starting to find, you know, the really, the really good parts of the quote “institution.”

I just got married too young, was too immature, too irresponsible, and had too much left to do. And along the way hurt some people. So, and then spent a lot of time the latter years making amends for that for the most part as much as you can. Nut now, I mean, I am very happily married. Not that there aren’t issues with it. That I’m looking forward to really understanding the marriage better as I go forward.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, how would you name one group, person, entity, corporation for it? I mean, isn’t everybody responsible for it? In my mind that, you know, debt. I don’t know, some of it is recognizing all of it; do we really have this kind of debt, does it really exist, you know? I don’t know, to me, it’s sort of an enigma. I don’t really, yeah we got trillions of dollars in debt, what does that mean? How does it affect anything?

Suppose we just said, “No we don’t.” What changes? Nothing changes. So, I’m sort of, I don’t know that anybody’s to blame for it. You can say a lot of large companies have moved in and out, you say the government has not been fiscally responsible and a lot of their, you know, the transfer-type payments, the social programs that are out there mismanaged, I think, to a certain extent. If you were to take it from pure large dollars, I think our government is so big that probably the largest part of it comes out of there just from mismanagement. And, but I can’t be specific about it; this is just some sort of just winging it out there.

I don’t know how you could say that anybody would be lesser or more or less responsible than our government. So, the Fed that comes in and then the deal with the Fed not really being a part of the government but a private, they’re in the mix too, banking is in the mix, everybody’s in the mix, but I don’t think you can go after any one group of people. But overall, I think, I think poor management of the cut. The country’s not run like a good, efficient company. It’s too big, it’s unwieldy and as a result, there’s a lot of loss.

Roscoe Brumback:

I mean, that’s a hell of a question. I mean, to try to capture that, I mean, my solution I should jump back to what Ross Perot said and say, “Yeah, there’s a lot of good plans up there I’ll just go grab one and run with it.”

I mean, I don’t know. Get with the right people, develop a plan. A plan that’s out there. Get people to agree with it and then stay with it. You know, put it into place. I think that we have to take care of people; the elderly, the homeless. I’m not saying I want to get rid of welfare or social security or any of that like that, I just want it to be managed properly and that’s sort of, that’s, we need these social programs I, but, they can’t just perpetuate themselves and we can’t just have it go on into eternity.

We have to have the ability to get people in and out of these programs. So if I was to look for a cure and I was to go and say that it’s a lot of the social programs that are spending them out of control and it seemed that they will go into perpetuity like that, I think there should be an effort to focus on a plan to get people back into the workforce more so than just figure out how we can get them more money.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well I mean, you know, there’s extremes. I wouldn’t go to like the Chinese, one child type thing, you know, but there has to be controls. I mean, you know, and in these, in these programs, you can’t just have it so that somebody can go out and have seven or eight children. I mean, I don’t know exactly how that’s done. Do we need to beef up, are these groups that monitor, you know, the welfare system, these social workers, are there enough social workers monitoring people? Do we really know what people, how long that people go on it? How long we, you know, what’s the requirements?

Roscoe Brumback:

It’s, you know, let’s develop some finite requirements here. If a person’s healthy enough to go on, are they mentally healthy enough to go on? Some evaluation there and then the set up temporary programs but not a program that perpetuates itself every year. So, I don’t know, I guess there would be more checks and balances to the system and more oversight with the people that are on the dole. And that’s probably, you know, that’s not an answer but I just think if you would take a look right now, if you talk about social workers.

In a case in point right now, trying to deal with my mother getting there transitioned into Medicaid. It’s the biggest bureaucratic nightmare I’ve ever seen with virtually every case worker, at least where I am in the Detroit area, completely inundated and will flat out tell you they have no abilities to complete their daily tasks. They do what they do. You are in line and that’s the way it works. That in other cases, I mean, it’s a, you know, so they get to people. There’s too many people on it to control it. So, I think guidelines, more stricter, stricter guidelines. And not strict and that it restricts, you know, their benefits, in that they’re in control and that the intent is to get them back into society and functioning as a normal worker.

Roscoe Brumback:

Well, so, if you were to take it from white collar type to blue collar who I work with a lot, both types I would see, that you would see that the white collar people for the most part, now the quote “white collar” on them for lack of a better term, they’re looking for, you know, more like a Republican-kind of candidate. They want change. And I think what a lot of people, one of my theories is I think Obama got elected because a lot of people were looking for change and so it was strictly, he got elected because he had promised a different kind of change.

Now, you’ve got Trump coming in and he’s promising something different for the middle and upper-middle class that they’re frustrated with. So maybe he’s not the best candidate in the world and, you know, obviously, you know, there’s a lot of issues about him, but he represents change and people are willing… so, I would say that near more white collar type worker is saying, “Let’s just bring about change and see if it benefits us at all. We feel like we’re carrying the brunt of a tax base” and things like that and feel like that, you know, we’re really, you know, supporting America.

The blue collar, more blue collar would be at least in the Detroit area, especially in all the Midwest for the most part, you know, all the automotive producing areas, they’re very much democratic-leaning and looking for more, you know, from the government to supply more to them, you know, in the unions. And the unions have lost some power and they’re trying to make a play back and come back strong again, that if you do, if you have a Republican group which is weird this time because Trump has sort of appealed to the unions in bringing work back, so he’s done a pretty good job there in appealing to a group of people that would have never listened to him before, but not doing it with more wages but doing it from the line of let’s keep America’s jobs here. So, he’s having an effect there that’s never been a factor before.

Roscoe Brumback:

The potential to get more. Not the management as much. Well, I would say, yeah, I would say that too but from both sides more of what they consider they need. You know, the management teams want to keep work here more so, you know, and more concerned with that and concerned with launching new jobs vs an hourly person who does, they don’t worry about it as much as that because they do the same type of work just with a different program for, say, an automotive. So, but, I just, I think both sides people are looking for a change. I would, I think, that’s it we’re, I think, from a management team we think that you know, we suffer the brunt of the tax base.

Roscoe Brumback:

Not, I don’t think, as a, this is just my opinion and not bound with any facts per say that I can quote, but I think that our foreign policy is non-existent. I don’t think that there’s any respect given to the US right now. I’m extremely concerned with the Middle East and some of the, you know, then, and Somalia and those areas. I think there’s a lot of people that would like to blow us up.

I think it’s a time for us to tighten our borders up. I know this flies in the face of a lot of people; that America was, you know, brought up on Ellis Island and that’s what we are, a nation of immigrants. That at a certain point, you have to, you have to take a look at the greatest good for the greatest number. It’s like triage.

By the greatest good for the greatest number right now, in my opinion, is to limit immigration. Let’s establish how we are going to work with it in the future. I’m not saying build a fence or anything like that or a wall; that won’t do anything. But let’s take a look at the, let’s just to control what we have now. Let’s take, let’s stop opening the gates and especially why we’re in situations where we cannot protect ourselves internally. So, I think it’s less a moral issue than it is a safety issue right now. So, I override the immorality that people see in it by stating that I think we need to take a harder look at immigration, control our borders under the gu… under the name of safety to protect ourselves as a nation.

Roscoe Brumback:

I don’t know what it is. I don’t really, I could guess at what I think social justice is. But I don’t fully, it’s not something I even think about. But if I take a look at social justice and I were to try to define it, I would think that, you know, social justice has to do with, you know, I mean, we’ve been stuck on this ethical approach to life and morality and things like that, so I think social justice is a matter of that, that, you know, society dictates certain actions of thinking people. And we can’t go into anarchy and just, you know, you have to have sanctions to maintain some sort of social justice. So, my ideal is social justice is just, it’s just how we do the right things in the world to keep the world running and don’t let it just run amok. but I have no, I haven’t given, to give you a definition of that that would mean anything to anybody, I don’t really know.

Roscoe Brumback:

An easy answer about where the US is going is: boy, I’m not sure. But I’m hopeful that we are going to try, you know, to protect ourselves, to get our country back together so that maybe long-term we could be more of a, I think, I think all of a sudden, you know, the internet and everything, and we are such a global society now, and everything. I don’t think that systems and procedures and everything is ready to handle the world as it is. It’s evolved too much and we’re going along and it seems like we’re putting Band-Aids on things that don’t work anymore or trying to revamp something or re-engineer something versus rethink a new way to work in the world, to be around the world. Because physically, things have changed. Just, just I mean, the speed of sound is nothing now, you know? I mean, so it’s like you can you can communicate with anybody any time. People are much have much more accessibility to information. Third World nations can even be called Third World nations anymore. Truthfully, I mean, they’re almost at a par because of the internet with a lot of things they can do and how we deal with people. The potential for war right now, to me, I’m really worried about, especially if the Republican Party gets in and it’s as hard line as being professed right now, if we’re not going to get into a situation where somebody will flip the switch, I’m very concerned. You know, with, you know, ISIS, these groups like that. And I think you take a look, the Russians just got beat to death in Afghanistan.

We’re doing the same thing. It seems like we just keep putting ourselves into these situations. I think we’ve got to get out, phase out, get our shit together domestically and then start talking about how we deal with the rest of the world. You still have to, I’m not saying close us off and just close the rest of the world out, but slow it down a little bit. Let’s take a look at how we’re running things. Let’s not try to put Band-Aids on a system that’s broken. Let’s take a look at reorganizing, getting a system if there is any possible way. I don’t, I think we’re going to have more gridlock no matter who gets elected this time. And that’s the thing that bothers me the most. The reason I’m concerned about the government, I have no faith in their ability to to really represent us anymore. And I think that they’re entity unto themselves and they spend their whole time campaigning to be where they are and then nothing ever gets done. And I think the cycle in here is just too narrow. They spend two years, you know, they come in, they clean up the last regimes, what they’re doing, implement their start to implement their regime. Then they spend the next half of it campaigning. So, it’s just constant change. And, you know, there’s gridlock. It’s this non-stop gridlock. Nothing is getting done. I’m concerned that nothing’s going to get done going forward here for the next election, no matter who gets elected. Whether the person I want does or doesn’t, I don’t think anything’s going to change. I think we’re going to be in gridlock.

And the only thing that I’m really concerned about is if somebody pulls a switch and somebody blows up, you know, some country. I think that that’s really, I started, I forgot about that from like the 60s. I used to be afraid as a little kid because of the Russians. And I used to you know, I was, I would think about it at night and it bothered me. All of a sudden, everything went away and I never thought about that anymore. For the first time in my life in the last two years, maybe I’m starting to think about the fact that there, that somebody could pull the bomb again. There’s enough radical groups out there. There’s enough fissionable material out there that people get it. And money can get anything. You could be Satan and still get, if you had the money to pay somebody on the earth, they would take it and blow somebody without any compunction about blowing up another country because they got the money. I’m concerned that there’s a long road for America to go and long road for the world to go. And especially if America is having, America is having problems, because I do believe we are the most benevolent nation and the biggest giver and a good guide overall for the rest of the world to follow a system that seems to work. And when it was working right before we tried to become everybody’s everything and politically correct to the point that it’s insane, that nothing gets done. So, I’m not, I’m not optimistic about what’s going on in the next 5 to 10 years.

Roscoe Brumback:

Pessimistic. I am not, I don’t, I think there’s so many bright people in the world and I just don’t think that they’re stepping up and coming into the positions where we need them. I got, I think there’s people out there that are great salesman that are making pitches to people that really think they want to buy this new car, that this new regime or something like that, but I don’t think we have any, I don’t think we have strong leadership. And I don’t see anybody coming up through the system even that even wants the job. You know, a lot of people are good and don’t even want the job.

Roscoe Brumback:

Skilled people. That’s all I want. I could be, I could be without any party affiliation if good, intelligent, thinking people were in that position, I could vote any party. I’m not voting the party, I’m voting the person. In the past, I think I’ve been more blindly party just because my father, but over the last years, I mean, I’ve voted more what I thought the people. But it’s been getting worse and worse over the last two elections for sure. It’s a, I’m voting for the lesser of evils rather than a viable candidate.

Doug Monroe:

Exactly, right. Alright, last question. It’s part your chance fora parting shot s, o my statement is, “So the boss becomes a farmer and rides into the sunset. Sounds like Shane to me.”

Roscoe Brumback:

I am, I am going to retire in the next—not fully retire, in the next five to six years. I’m really considering buying my wife’s family’s farm. And God knows what I’m going to do when I get out there in the wide-open country. What I will grow, if you catch my drift. but I am going to start settling down and I’m going to consult for a while, probably do that on and off, but I’m slowing my pace down now. I’m done with my career. My real career. Now I’m just paying bills and trying to get a little bit of cash to you know, have a little bit of fun before I croak.

Doug Monroe:

Thank you, my friend. Unless you have anything else to say, I think I’ve hit the mother lode.

Roscoe Brumback:

Cool, it was fun.

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